Sicko...

[Teddy Rogers]

Today I watched the film Sicko by Michael Moore. It is shocking to see how bad the health care system is in America, I never thought it was that cruel to its own citizens.

Having experienced health care in Europe and watching this film it reminds me to appreciate what Americans having got or more appropriately what they don't get allowed to receive.

I hope this American system never gets to be adopted in Australia...

Ted.

[Guest P43]

Man, I bet diseases will over rule this nation, because of all the bad food they eat. There was also something about KFC, it was on teh news they showed "the organisms", I still cant believe people who eat that crap. Here is the link:

/>http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/fooddrink/a/kfc_chicken.htm

There are many people who still say that its a hoax, well they showed the so called chickens on TV. And do u really think KFC would admit it?

About Americans, I think they are larger then Europeans, except for the Dutchies. Everytime when I see an American citizen on TV, he or she is fat. Didnt you notice that?

Edited October 25, 2007 by P43

[Killboy]

When I once ate at KFC (that was in the Netherlands ) I was really disgusted by the food :x

The chicken wings were all oily and tasted like old butter and it was sort of chewy

Still, I LOVE McDonalds, the food tastes good, even though the prices are slightly too high to go to lunch there every day...

I don't really Burger King though, the hamburgers there always tend to fall apart right when you bite off :-/

The problem with Americans is (I guess) that they somehow aren't afraid of disgracing themselves at weird TV shows.

I'm not saying Americans aren't fat, there certainly are more 'plump' Americans out there, on the other hand there are a lot more Americans than for example Frenchmen, so they attract your attention more...

Anyway, I doubt the food is as 'infected' as you probably think, it will certainly not cause any disease

[Guest P43]

Anyway, I doubt the food is as 'infected' as you probably think, it will certainly not cause any disease

I wasnt thinking it its infected, but when people eat a lot of that rubbish soon or late they will get heart problems and much more then that.

About the MacDonalds, those hamburgers on the TV commercials I always see one big burger, but when I see it by my self, its one small piece of sh!T, like if some fat american sit on it. Also I see many people eat fries hamburgers in the morning I really think its not healty as they think. Thats why I think many people will get ill because of all the unhealty stuff they eat.

Personally the Macdonalds stuff doesnt even fill me when I eat it, its like they have manipulated it somehow. I eat a lot, but Im not fat because I do many stuff that makes me sweat.

Ever noticed how many black people are in the KFC? Its no offence but, many black females have a very large a$$.

[Blah]

i saw this awhile back (there was a screener of this before it was out in moviez)...im in usa..i was shocked to see how much better other countries have it..

crazy stuff!!!

regarding mcdonalds go watch "super size me".... you might change your mind next time your heading thru that drive thru..

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0390521/

[Guest P43]

Oh I saw that one too, 30days he ate only MacDonalds stuff. He didnt finish the whole 30 days, because his body was in a danger condition, if he continued he would die for sure. Thats why I also tought that in the future many people will get diseases and die because of all the crap they eat. Thats one reason why I never go to the Mac.

And could you imagine that people eat that crap as their breakfast???

Edited October 25, 2007 by P43

[Teddy Rogers]

Not everyone in America spends all day dining at fast food places, there are healthy eating people there. What the movie was getting at, no matter your lifestyle the health care system in the US is more focused around profits and profit margins than it does to guarantee the health and welfare of those people who have paid or are paying for private health care...

Ted.

[ECLiPTiC]

I've not seen the movie, so I can't talk detials. However, here in the states there is a lot of negative buzz about the movie. Americans are upset with Michael Moore's portrayal of the health care system. I'm sure a lot of it is due to national pride, as it's far from perfect. From what I've heard, the movie attacks insurance providers, drug companies, and heath care professionals by showing the viewers the system at it's worst. He's hand selected very emotional stories for his film, stories that show the whole system as being money driven instead of having any interest in it's patients.

I live close to the border between Canada and the USA. The Canadians, like many other countries have a socialist health care system. Yet, many Canadians cross the border into America for care of premature babies. Many socialist governments just let babies who are born 25 weeks and earlier die. They don't administer any care to the babies. This helps increase life expectancy, and lowers infant mortality rates. They don't consider a pre-mature baby an infant! My oldest son was born at 27 weeks... very close to the 25 week cut off. He spent almost 90 days in the hospital before we could bring him home, but now he is perfectly healthy and my insurance covered all the expenses. I consider myself lucky to have access to the care that was provided for him. Anyway, this is just one example of the good side of things here.

In fact, Sicko persuaded a counter attack. There's a movie being made as a response. It's called Sick and Sicker... here is the site:

<a href="http://anonym.to/?http://www.sickandsickermovie.com/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.sickandsickermovie.com/index.html</a>

I guess to get both sides of the story one should watch both movies.

Oh yea, the majority of Americans that I know are not fat. They eat healthy and exercise. The Super Size Me movie is a little out of wack... the guy ate over 5000 calories a day and didn't exercise. Most anyone who eats 5000 calories a day and doesn't exercise will gain weight and be unhealthy. In response to Super Size Me watch Bowling for Morgan... this guy goes on a 30 day McDonalds diet and loses 20 pounds, by simply not over eating and choosing healthier items from their menu. Sorry for going off topic!

[Teddy Rogers]

There is no denying he will have picked the cases that would help to drum home his point of view but part of what he was saying was that those types of cases are becoming common place and that the system itself needs to be reformed to make it less profit orientated and more focused on the welfare of the patient - that and the expensive drugs.

The Canadians, like many other countries have a socialist health care system.

That is another point Mr Moore hit on, about Americans being told (or scare-mongered) to believe that state run health care systems is the start of or part of a socialist system. The Canadian health care system, like many other state run health care systems around the world, are not socialist systems. I'm sorry but to say the Canadian system is a socialist health care system is just factually wrong.

Many socialist governments just let babies who are born 25 weeks and earlier die.

Which governments? Maybe this is due to certain health care systems in particular countries not having the necessary intensive care baby units and maybe a reason why Canadians come to American hospitals because they specialise in that area. Do Canadians have to pay hospital fees if they are sent to America or does the Canadian government pick up the bill?

Anyway... even state run health care systems have their flaws and I am sure a number of cases could be highlighted and forum members here could easily give their own experiences. However if you are ill you should not have to worry about bills or who you need to contact to get permission for being treated in which hospital and for how long - or denied treatment.

America being the most wealthiest nation in the world is quite a way down the list of The World Health Organization's rankings of the world's health systems, placed 37th. The American system seems like it needs to be reformed. I don't live there, only Americans can give us the real picture but are you 100% sure you can really rely on your own health insurance when you need it the most?...

Ted.

[ECLiPTiC]

Was I incorrect placing the "socialist" label on state run health care systems? Here in the states we define a socialist health care system as a system in which the government subsidizes the cost of health care. Canada does have this type of heath care system. Here is a recent news report on the pre-mature baby subject that I was talking about.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,300939,00.html

I can not tell you off the top of my head which governments do not treat very premature babies, it's something that I read once in a reliable news magazine.

I agree with you that the American system is flawed and needs reform. I'm lucky to have good insurance that provides me the peace of mind to not worry about where my family will receive treatment, and to not need permission to get treatment. However, there are citizens who are not as fortunate and have to jump through hoops just to see a doctor for the common cold.

[Teddy Rogers]

Was I incorrect placing the "socialist" label on state run health care systems? Here in the states we define a socialist health care system as a system in which the government subsidizes the cost of health care. Canada does have this type of heath care system. Here is a recent news report on the pre-mature baby subject that I was talking about.

<a href="http://anonym.to/?http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,300939,00.html" target="_blank">http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,300939,00.html</a>

I can not tell you off the top of my head which governments do not treat very premature babies, it's something that I read once in a reliable news magazine.

I agree with you that the American system is flawed and needs reform. I'm lucky to have good insurance that provides me the peace of mind to not worry about where my family will receive treatment, and to not need permission to get treatment. However, there are citizens who are not as fortunate and have to jump through hoops just to see a doctor for the common cold.

I think we will have to disagree on calling the Canadian system a socialist health care system when over 30% of it is funded by the private sector.

As for the number of Canadian births taking place in America, as pointed out in the article it is primarily due to underfunding and lack of foresight. It is something that can happen anywhere, private or state run, if trends are not watched. It is not a flaw because it is a state or "socialist" system.

I do not agree with private health care, I totally abhor it. It helps towards feeding the classes, denies the poor and penalises those with inherited genetic flaws. If you use it frequently because you have a medical condition you are penalised, your premiums go up until you cannot get cover - if they allow you cover at all. So many people in the US have medical bills so excessive it forces them in to bankruptcy or to not seek medical attention altogether. You never hear of people going bankrupt over medical bills in countries with state health care, being thrown out of hospitals or denied treatment because they couldn't afford to pay.

I would rather have to pay more taxes and have a state health care system which covers all their citizens. If people then want to have private health care they should stick with private hospitals and not use up the state systems...

Ted.